Rule 62 Radio
Rule 62 Radio is a place where stories of hope and healing are shared. The content you will find here focuses on recovery through the 12 steps as they were written in The Big Book of Alcoholics Anonymous. No ads. No intros. No editing except to protect anonymity. Just honest recovery and messages of hope from people who know what it means to be hopeless.
This podcast has no affiliation with AA or any other organization. The stories and opinions expressed here are solely those of the individuals sharing them.
All the people you will hear agreed to be recorded to help carry the message of recovery. Some speakers choose to use their full names and I leave those in unless specifically asked. If you hear a speaker using the full name of someone other than their own or breaking anonymity in some other form please email rule62radio@gmail.com about it. It's helpful if you can provide the episode title and time in the episode where that happens. I do my best to edit out things like that but I'm a father of four and this is a labor of love that I do in my free time so I miss things sometimes.
The things I've learned while making these recordings have had a big impact on my life and I sincerely hope others get something valuable from it as well. Thanks for listening!
Rule 62 Radio
Step 10 - Phoenix House Sep 18, 2026
Use Left/Right to seek, Home/End to jump to start or end. Hold shift to jump forward or backward.
The Phoenix House Speaker Series has rotating guests talk about their experience with each of the 12 steps found in the Big Book and the 12 & 12.
The messages I post to Rule 62 Radio have changed my life and I hope they will have an impact on you as well.
You can help me carry the message of hope and recovery by rating/reviewing Rule 62 Radio wherever you listen so it gets recommended to more people.
All the speakers you will hear agreed to be recorded to help carry the message of recovery. Some speakers choose to use their full names and I leave those in unless specifically asked. If you hear a speaker using the full name of someone other than their own or breaking anonymity in some other form please email me about it. It's helpful if you can provide the episode title and time in the episode where that happens. I do my best to edit out things like that but I'm a father of four and this is a labor of love that I do in my free time so things make it past me sometimes.
My name is Daryl. I'm an alcoholic. Daryl. Uh grace of God, good sponsorship in the program Alcoholics Anonymous. I got sober on January 4th, 2014. And for that I'm extremely grateful. Man, I love this place. There is there's really good stuff happening uh at the Phoenix houses. So um nowhere else I'd rather be. So glad to be here. Glad to be here. So step 10, continue to take personal inventory and when wrong, promptly admitted it. Um how many people here think that you believe you have an act of 10th step practice? Okay. How many of you think that that uh what that entails is your evening review? A couple people, a few people, a handful of people? Yeah. So it's there is no wrong answer. There's there's absolutely no wrong answer. Um I think that the tenth step may be one of the more challenging or difficult steps uh, you know, to practice, uh, you know, because it's really talking about awareness. You know, it's it's we're gonna get into, I want to talk about what the book says about it, um, because it's really wonderful to take a look at it in a practical sense. So this notion of awareness, and um, you know, because it says continue to watch for selfishness, dishonesty, resentment, and fear, and when these crop up, you know, ask God at once to remove them. Uh, you know, tell somebody um immediately, you know, and if you've harmed anybody, go make it right quickly, then resolute to your thoughts, right? So this notion then uh about the tenth step is is about awareness. And and I think it was very difficult for me to get to a place where I was aware because I wasn't present a lot of times. You know, I I remember uh early in recovery when I was making amends to my kids uh who are now adults, you know, they're like, man, dad, even when you were here, you were never present. And I was always blocked by, you know, what what I thought was going on in my life, what should have been going on in my life, what I thought you should be doing, what I thought other people shouldn't have been doing. And it was really hard for me to be present and aware of anything other than kind of like that cycle in my mind or what I thought needed to happen. So I love the fact that the uh the book and the steps give us really practical ways to look at things. So on page 84, and let me uh let me uh I'll start with just the you know the 10-step promise. There's a number of them, and I would like to hit on them. But I remember when I first sat down with the the gentleman that sponsored me for over 10 years. Um uh his name was Gary, uh, and he passed, I guess, two years ago in August. And he was a beautiful guy. He died with 59 years of sobriety. And and he would be what people would call a big book enthusiast. I really don't like some of the things that we say about big book uh, you know, people who say thumper, that's not the greatest thing. But we use a word sometimes about people who are involved in World War II. I'm like, why would we ever be insulting to anybody that was enthusiastic about the big book of Alcoholics Anonymous? Right. So I, you know, if you're preachy, you know, I get that, right? But I I'm I'm glad that I'm enthusiastic about the big book.
SPEAKER_01Yeah.
SPEAKER_00But he said, hey, uh he qualified me. We talked about the three legacies, you know, unity, recovery, and service. And I was just talking about how difficult my life had been. You know, I'd gotten to a place where um, you know, I I was contemplating suicide. And I never really ever considered suicide whenever I was out running and gunning. I would have said that's a that's a way of weakness, right? Um, but I was telling about that to explain uh problems that I was having with uh with family members and just with life in general. You know, I had a marriage, the first marriage I tore down after 13 years, and the second one was headed to the toilet. Uh, you know, I was bumping up against bankruptcy, I'm going to jail. Um, you know, the thing about Alcoholics Anonymous, if you've been arrested more than three times, you can just say you've been arrested several times. So I've been arrested several times. And, you know, he said, Well, Daryl, check this out. If you're willing to go through this process, and he was willing to take me line by line through this process. And he says, and I'll do this with you. Then that promise in the 12th step is you're gonna have an awakening, right? And you're gonna be spiritually, you're gonna wake up, you know, take that spirit into the, you know, that awakened spirit into the world and be useful. Uh, he goes, but you won't ever have to pick up a drinker or a drugger again. And that seemed far-fetched to me because I had tried to stop many times. And I stopped many times. I couldn't stay stopped. You know, and the last time that I uh So the other thing I think about is this sometimes we say God's, you know, I got the educational variety of spiritual experience, you know, and people go, well, Wilson had something where God was sudden, you know, the impact of God on Bill Wilson was sudden, right? It was it was profound. And I gotta tell you, the last time I was arrested, you know, I almost t-boned a police officer and I got arrested, you know, I was they thought I was fleeing, there's a bunch of drugs in the car. This is my second one in a short period of time, and I knew I was gonna go to jail. And for those that can't tell, I use hair products. And I wasn't looking forward to that. Um, you know, again, going back to jail. But I I hadn't worked a stat, man. I hadn't uh I hadn't met a sponsor, I hadn't been to a meeting, I hadn't cracked this book open. And yet, after decades of trying to stop, that night I was separated from alcohol and drugs. And so as I look back, and I often think that life is about I'm living it through the windshield, but experiencing it in the in the rearview mirror, that I think that my life and and God's impact on me was sudden and profound because grace showed up that night. I didn't do anything to earn it. So think about your own story. You know, when you took your last drink or your last drug, that's sudden and profound. Even though at the moment it didn't seem like it. In hindsight, that was pretty sudden and profound, you know. And so I'm really, really grateful for that. But he says, hey, you're gonna get to a point where you cease, this is on the bottom eight. If you're gonna cease fighting anything, including uh anything or anybody, including alcohol, then if you're tempted, you're gonna recoil like a hot flame, you know, from the temptation of alcohol or drugs. And then it goes on to say it's just like you're not gonna be interested in liquor, uh, you know, if a temp you recoil, and you're gonna react sanely and normally. So that's kind of like the consummation of step two, and you're gonna find that this has happened automatically. And he said, which part of that promise is hard for you? And I said, Well, the the the part about, you know, ceasing to fight anything or anybody, I can't imagine that. Because I'm fighting somebody at all times, whether I'm saying it out loud or in my mind, there's always a struggle going on. You know, I was always fighting something. And then this whole notion that I'm gonna be able to recoil from the temptation of alcohol or drugs and that it's gonna happen automatically. Like, how I'm just like, that's crazy. And he said, Okay, so what I want you to do is just put a marker in that, and we're gonna do everything that this book asks us to do up until page 83, and then we're gonna come back and visit this promise. And I'm gonna ask you whether or not you're continuing to fight everything or anybody. I'm gonna ask whether or not the obsession to drink or drug has been removed from you. You know, it's funny today, you guys, and this sounds crazy, and uh I know how to drink and I know how to drug. I don't believe I have the power to do it today. Because there's something in between me and that drink and that drug. I mean, I know how to climb onto the top of the roof and jump off. But I'm not going, please don't let me climb up on top of the roof and jumping off. You know, I know how to go lay down in the middle of the street, but I want to see Walt hold me, hold me back. I don't want to go lay down in the middle of the street. So that thing about jumping off the roof, I don't invent gravity, I prove it. And so what's been proven to me is if I'm willing to do the things up to this point that I can show up and my life's transformed and I'm not fighting anything or anybody. And that at the time sounded like something miraculously because all I'd ever done is fight people. So at the end of the night said promises, right? And it's so funny we were talking before. Um, what were we talking about, Josh? He said the promises. I said I was walking liner and just filming. Oh, yeah. Yeah, but I mean I so I I I've ran a bunch of recovery house you guys, and I I got guys in the house that I've ran, they go, hey man, new Jordans, the promises are coming true. Oh yeah, my phone went back to a normal size, and he goes, The promises, yeah. Or I got the parking spot, the promises. And I'm like, dude, that is that's that's a byproduct of you going to work every day, you can buy Jordans. That is not the promises and alcoholics and but this says this thought then brings us to step 10, which suggests that we continue. And so there's this theme that's gonna happen about continue. We continue to take personal inventory and continue, second time, continue, to set right any new mistakes as we go along. And then we vigorously commence. So if you're doing something with, you know, with a vigor, you're doing it with some focus, right? So we vigorously commence this way of living. The thing that I've discovered about the steps of Alcoholics Anonymous is that eventually, you know, you can work the steps discreetly, but the numbers fall away, and it becomes a way of life. You know, I'm moving with principles that are applied to my life that are spiritual in nature, right? So it becomes a way of living. As we clean up the past, we've entered the world of the spirit. And that's the first time the book kind of says, now you're in it, you're in the world of the spirit, because that was kind of it was confusing to me. I'm like, how do you get to the world of the spirit? You know, and everybody has an opinion about that. And we we often wanted to fault back to here's my religious experience, which can be a spiritual experience, right? But the world of the spirit, I think, is is uh my experience has been it's something different than than just believing in a particular set of beliefs or or theology. And then it goes on, it says, Well, our next function is to grow in understanding and effectiveness. And I think it's understanding of the world of the spirit, not that I understand it, but it's kind of like God of my understanding. I can only understand God, but I have my own experience that I can hold on to. And then effectiveness in the world is I think what it would be describing here. So it says uh this is not an overnight matter. It should continue for a lifetime. So it's three continues, and now it's getting ready to give these four instructions. So this is where I say, you know, the evening review. I mean, it actually talks about, you know, uh upon a uh awakening and when retiring in step 11 and doing an evening review, right? So there, these are four ways that we can move through our day and continue to watch and to be present. So it says continue to watch for the same four things Wilson wrote about selfishness, dishonesty, resentment, and fear. So I'm on the lookout for that, right? And when it crops up, not if, it's kind of like if you're going to the bus station, you're going because you believe the bus is coming. So I don't get to a point where these things, you know, are no longer part of my life, but my awareness of them has changed. And hopefully it's not after the fact that I'm aware of it. I'm aware of it as it's occurring. And then in the 11th step, it goes on and says, hey, you know, before agitated, you know, or doubtful, you know, pause. I can exercise this pause software that's been downloaded as a result of this stuff. But it says, when they cry, you know, when these crop up, we ask God at once, that's a prayer, at once, to remove them. You know, we know through six and seven that that's a matter of willingness, and God's gonna remove what he sees fit to remove, right? So I ask God to remove them at once, and then I discuss this with someone immediately. So if I'm doing, if I'm watching and I ask God at once, and I'm I'm telling somebody immediately, I'm not doing that in the evening. Right? At once and immediately is I immediately am talking to you. At once I looked at Wall. If it's not, I looked at Walt in the evening, right? So this, and I say that not to be critical about the way that we perceive these two steps, but there is there is a prag, a practical step and a way to move through our day that we can use this thing as a kit, the uh, you know, part of the kit of tools uh that can bring me to a place where I'm I'm experiencing these promises that I just read. So it says continue to watch for selfies, sorry, we're resentment of fear. When these crop up, ask God at once to remove them. And then the third thing it says is discuss this with someone immediately and then make amends quickly if you harmed anyone, and then resolutely turn your thoughts to someone you can help. So I have what I would call 10th step buddies. And it's not a 30-minute conversation, but if something's going on throughout the day, and all of a sudden, you know, I'm either you know consumed with fear by something or I'm on one because I'm resentful, or I did something dishonest, I'll call him like, Jason, you got time for a tenth step? And I remember calling my sponsor one time, I said, Hey, Gary, I'm calling for a tent step. And he said, Have you prayed about it? And I said, Well, no, click. That was not very loving, right? And I called back, and at that time he probably would have been sober 50 years. And he says, Dare, I can't keep myself sober. You know, what I'm trying to do is get you connected with some power that's greater than you. You know, I'm a human in those ABCs where you say, you know, uh, no human can solve my problem. You can certainly, you know, God can use you and you can support, but his deal was like, I want you to turn towards something that can help you in a way that I can't, right? So, okay, tell me what's going on. I took credit for work today, uh, you know, for something at work today that I didn't do. What'd you do? My partner Elliot came up with a great idea. I ran it up the flagpole. I didn't give Elliot credit. I kind of implied that I fought it because I wanted to get the uh uh the recognition. It's like, okay, so I'm telling somebody immediately, have you harmed anybody? Well, not intentionally, but this would be harmful to him if he heard it. He says, Well, then you need to go make it right. And they go, and then you need to turn your thoughts to someone that you can help. So it doesn't say after you do those three things that you go to Phoenix house and you know you listen to a fist-up. I mean, that could be. But for me, initially, it was like, okay, I'm stuck in this thing. I'm gonna get, you know, God involved with it. I'm gonna tell somebody about it, I'm gonna go clean it up. Hey, Elliot, I regret the fact that I I misled somebody about an idea that you had that I took credit for. I'm sorry. Then I ask him, man, because we're now we're talking about this. Is there anything else that I've done that's causing you a problem? And how do I clean that up? How do I make it right, right? And then I turn my thoughts. So if I turn my thoughts, I'm just thinking, well, maybe I should just see if if if Chad's doing all right, man. How's your day going? I found that it's it's almost impossible for me to stay in self if I do those four things in a pragmatic way. You know, if I'm fearful about some financial thing, I'm talking to God, I'm calling Scotty, and we're talking about it. I haven't heard anybody, but I'm gonna turn my thoughts and I'm gonna go say, hey, Chris, man, I thought you said you were gonna holler at me. How are you doing? Well, now I'm not in self. So then it says, um, love and tolerance of others is our code. That's a t-shirt and a coffee mug. Right? Because sometimes I can't be loving if you're not, if you're in like when we talk about that four step, it's not just the resentment, the replaying of emotion, but it goes on to say if someone's interfering, if somebody's hurting you, then sometimes I can just be hurt because I don't think you've included me. You know, I can be threatened because I think Michael's talking about me. And he's really not, but he's looking at me like I'm short, so I'm not gonna allow Mike, I'm not gonna like Michael first before he doesn't like me, you know, and all the other games that we play, right? So then it says, okay, after after I do these things and I begin to practice them on a regular basis, the thing that happens for me is there's an awareness that wasn't there before, and now I'm present. And the beautiful thing about being present is really what I am, is is present consciousness. Right? That's what I am. I'm the watcher of stuff, the things that's happening. And the other thing that's cool about being present, because I'm not a time traveler, the only place that I can get any encouragement is if I'm present right now. And I experience a connection with Cody, and I can get some hope, or I can get some encouragement. It's the only place that I can experience love, it's the only place that I can experience forgiveness, it's the only place that I can experience hope, joy, laughter, I gotta be here. And if I'm distracted and I'm off to what happened yesterday, and you can't even be here with me, right? Or whomever it is that you're talking with, like I used to be the guy that, man, I can wait for my turn to talk. And Bill might have said to me sometime over there, he said, you really ought to listen more. Or you know, we or would you be interested to listen with as much intention as you want someone to hear you? You know, am I willing to do that? So when I show up and I'm present, I get these things that that can come along with that. It's like, oh, now I'm not fighting. I can be a part of, I can feel community, I can feel connected. So the power of this power is only available right now. So I gotta live in between the claps. So I'm gonna seldom, I'm gonna cease anything or anybody for this by time, sanity will have returned. So this is what I'm saying. So came to believe. We don't take, we don't get the second step in the second step. Came to believe, as things are occurring, I'm I'm believing in a different way. I'm seeing all these people that are miracles in front of me. I believe in a different way than I did before I got here.
unknownRight?
SPEAKER_00And then the sanity returning is saying, if you get to this place where that you're in the world of the spirit, sanity will return. And so what I would ask you to do is ask somebody that's been around for a minute, that's doing the disciplines of 10 and 11 and going, Are you do you feel insane? Says we react sanely and normally, and we will find that this has happened automatically. We will see that our new attitude towards liquor andor drugs has been given us without any thought or effort on our part. It just comes. Exclamation point. That is the miracle of it. We are not fighting it, neither are we avoiding temptation. We feel as though we've been placed in a position of neutrality and safety. We're protected. We have not even sworn off. Instead, the problem has been removed. It does not exist for us. We're neither cocky nor afraid. That is our experience. This is how we react so long as we keep in fit spiritual condition. Now, how is it possible for people that would drive across state lines to wait on the dope man to have this problem removed? And how does it happen automatically? When I first read that, I'm like, the recovery ferries are swinging in, and it's you know, I'm like, how does this happen? He goes, it's kind of let me give you a metaphor. If you say, you know what, I really want to do, man, I want to feel better, you know, Eddie. He's a he's Eddie's buff, man. But I want to feel better, I want to look better, uh I want to have more energy in a very platonic way, Eddie. I find you attractive. But if you want to feel those things, you you can't sit here and go, okay, I'm gonna feel better, I'm gonna be stronger, I'm gonna look better, I'm gonna have more energy. You can't think your way to that. But if you get up and move and you do things and you could get a good night's sleep and you eat well, the byproduct automatically from that behavior is you feel better. You look better. That's how that happens. The byproduct of me doing everything that's up to this point and putting this discipline in my life. That's why I said to you, I can't drink today. I don't have the power to, I know how to. But if I thought that I had to come here, you guys, and just the rest of my life go, God, I hope I don't drink, I don't know if this would be such a good deal. Now, early on, you know, somebody said, You shouldn't just go hang out in Krakow, see if you can smoke like a gentleman. You know, so I know I know there's certain things that I shouldn't do, but I'm not cocky about it. But it also says that I'm not afraid. I've been placed in this position of neutrality, confident, and because of the this power that's intervened. Let me just take you real quick to page 51. 51 says when many hundreds of people are able to say that the consciousness of the presence, being present, the presence of God is today the most important factor of their lives, they present a powerful reason why one should have faith. I have faith. Not only am I not gonna worry about drinking or drugging anymore, I'm gonna be able to walk through my life. I am walking. Through my life of peace. So if that's not what you've experienced, then what I'm suggesting is that you know pay attention because this is a preview of coming attractions. What's on offer here, everybody, is transformation, not just behavior modification. There's more on offer. You can't jump in the in the ocean and not get wet. You can't run out in the sun and not get in some heat and not getting some sunshine. You cannot get in the presence of this power without being changed. So I'm not fighting. We feel as though we've been placed in it. So this is how we react as long as we feel. So then it goes on. It says, okay, it's easy to let up on the spiritual program of action and rest on our laurels. We are headed for trouble if we do, for alcohol is a subtle foe. So I got respect for alcohol. We are not cured of alcoholism. What we really have is a daily reprieve contingent on the maintenance of our spiritual condition. So here's the thing about this whole recovery and recovered thing, and people want to trip off that. And I'm like, why don't you just go see what they say about it? You know, what they say is you recover from a hopeless state of mind and body. It doesn't mean that you've cured of alcoholism. You know, but if anybody's ever been in the street and you got shot in the shoulder, you can go have it treated. Doesn't make you bulletproof. But you can go have it treated, right? And so what this is saying, if you're willing to do the things that treat the symptoms of alcoholism, irritability, restlessness, discontentedness, a prey to misery and depression, unable to control my emotional nature, can't seem to be of real help to other people, all that second half of step one, you can get to a place where you're not suffering from that. My wife has been uh cancer-free for 11 years. She took the treatment, she's not cured, it could come back, but she doesn't suffer from the symptoms of cancer today. So every day is a day that when we must carry the vision of God's will into our uh into all of our activities. How can I best serve thee, right? So here, let me just talk to you again about these promises and try to get to the point where we wrap it up here. It says much has already been said about receiving strength, inspiration, and direction from him who has all knowledge and power. If we carefully follow the directions. And here's the thing about the directions, y'all. It says we begin to sense the flow of his spirit into us, to some extent we become God conscious. God conscious. Hold on for a second. 567, a spiritual uh appendix. Most of us think this awareness, awareness again, this awareness of a power greater than ourselves is the essence of spiritual experience, or more religious members call it God consciousness. Same things, the same themes over and over and over again. This is we begin to develop this uh this vital sixth sense, but we must go further, and that means more action. So think about a vital sixth sense. You know, Eddie was walking around handing donuts out, or somebody was, maybe Ben was doing it, somebody was handing donuts out. If you taste that, you can say, Well, that tastes good because you got the uh the sense of uh of taste. Or somebody smells wonderful in here, you go, man, you smell delicious, you know, or you touch it and it's hot. This thing is promising that this communion or connection with this power through things like being useful to one another, holding space for one another to find out what's up, be in there whenever somebody needs that. You know, all those things uh, you know, of service to each other. There's something that shows up in that deal. When I do those things, I can experience this God consciousness and I get this sixth sense that it's intuition, and it's saying that I can rely on it. Right? So if this sounds crazy and it sounded crazy to me when I first heard it, I would just ask you, what do you have to lose? But to get through this work, make your amends, get to the point where it says, This thought brings us to step 10. And then use this tool as you're going about your day in a practical way. Continue to watch for selfishness, dishonesty, resentment, and fear when it cross up. Ask God at once, remove it, tell someone immediately, make amends quickly, turn my thoughts to someone, I'll help. And then Larry's gonna come next week and talk about how we can start our day and our evening. And what I've discovered is if I be if I retire at night and I review my day with my evening review, and then I wake up and upon awakening, I follow those instructions on 80, you know, 84, 86, 87, and then I those are my bookends, and then I put this activity between those bookends, dude. I'm killing it. As a C student, I'm killing it. That's the offer here. Grateful, dear alcoholic.